Chews

Dietary/feeding issues
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montecarlogirl87
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Chews

Post by montecarlogirl87 » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:10 pm

what are you recommendations/favorites for chews? ... I know antlers are a favorite for long time chewing... but what about more treat style?

I like mixing up giving them small treats, which they immediately inhale, and something they can take out back and chew on for a few mins

I've wanted to try Himalayan and bully sticks but they're a little out of my price range until I can find another job... but what about tracheas? hooves? ... I saw pig tails at the store last time I went, but I'm not sure how I feel about the small vertebra bones inside...

I've fed pig ears in the past, although I'm not a big fan, but I did see a "compressed pig skin" bone at the store, which is at least better than rawhide

I tried rib bones once, but I didn't like the way they broke into little pieces
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Re: Chews

Post by Raven » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:29 pm

Hey! There you are! You've been hiding! Hope the skin thing worked out okay.

Just wanted to say that bully sticks and ears are gone is seconds, anyway, so when money's tight, the sticks especially aren't worth it.

I don't give raw bones b/c Thor has a chipped canine. I stuff different Kongs with carrots, bell peppers, etc. or the small-hole Kongs with cheese (if you get it right, the cheese gets kind of pasty as they work it, so it doesn't crumble up and out). Nothing will last as long as you'd probably like since once they figure out the first time the best way of working the Kong. That's why I have lots of different ones and keep trying new things to put in them.

Some folks freeze Kongs with plain yogurt or natural peanut butter inside. It would seem a dog would never actually get the treat, though; just work at it trying to. (My guy wouldn't go for that. Fool's game, he'd say.)
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Re: Chews

Post by NewlyDutched » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:37 pm

I'm feeding raw so they have that to chew on. I also will give them beef marrow bones, I just take them away once they chew off the meat and marrow, to avoid chipped teeth.

The new Dutchie seems to enjoy chewing plastic... so II got him some jumbo nylabones.

They both really like cow hooves. Oh, and I found this on pintrest, I want to make them a few and see how they last!

http://www.instructables.com/id/Indestructible-Dog-Toy/

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Re: Chews

Post by montecarlogirl87 » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:43 pm

Shota's mange took a long time to deal with :cry: my dad was taking her to an old school vet that did Mitaban dips, she looked better after the first couple, but then backslid... I had some rather heated arguments with my father cus he was determined to dump motor oil on her

I finally took her to a different vet who put her on a ivermectin treatment and after another 2-3 months she finally had 2 consecutive negative skin scrapes \o/ so now she's all clear :) her fur just needs to finish growing back in

I've got some chicken "jerky" treats, but they're like meat fruit roll ups and are gone in a second... I also have a bag of these salmon treats, which take them oh, maybe 30 seconds :lol:

http://www.petco.com/product/118634/Blu ... reats.aspx

I like to mix things up, I'll give them a bite of the chicken jerky as a reward, or half a salmon stick if they're being really good or I'm about to leave the house for an extended amount of time or something, but I also like to give them the occasional treat that's more substantial... that they can take out into the sun and enjoy for a few minutes

I used to feed the occasional bone with the dogs I had as a kid, but I'm scared now about the way they chip and splinter and the potential damage to teeth.... my girls have no interest in the Nylabones, there's two out back they have never touched :|
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Re: Chews

Post by LyonsFamily » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:53 pm

I dehydrate my own chicken feet and trachea, but they're not really chews. The only bully sticks that worked were the huge braided ones and they didn't last long enough to justify the price.

I do like frozen pork hocks as long as they're not vertically split. I feed frozen so they last longer, but the bones in them are completely edible, so there's no chipped teeth. I get about 20 minutes from the smaller ones.

The sheep hooves worked well, especially filled with something and frozen. The only downside is that they smell and Elli thinks we like them placed under our pillows at night. We've tried the Himalayan dog chews, but Odin ate his in a few seconds. They lasted a lot longer with my parents' dogs.

I mainly do kongs and antlers though.
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Re: Chews

Post by Raven » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:56 pm

Thor isn't interested in Nylabones, either, unless they're slathered with something. Once it's licked off, though....

I'd try the Mike Genius (or Genius Mike) Kong for starters. There's more to experiment with on that Kong. You can add to the Kong repertoire as the budget allows...or as Santa deems appropriate.

Glad to hear your girl's better!!
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Re: Chews

Post by Dutchringgirl » Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:22 pm

Moose antlers is all they get.
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Re: Chews

Post by NewlyDutched » Sun Jul 26, 2015 10:18 pm

Oh, and not really an inside treat (and again they are on raw) the occasonal whole frozen cornish game hen when I find them at a good price is really entertaining.

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Re: Chews

Post by cordeliandemon » Tue Aug 04, 2015 1:12 pm

on the topic of treats and chews i got a few different things for demons week in a boarding kennel starting on the 16th, if anyone has any suggestions for extra special ones i can send along with him it would be most appreciated :) i need things that have the same draw effect as a piece of fresh ham/chicken if possible, just in case he needs to be bribed into going somewhere or doing something (i dont want them trying to leash or walk him while hes there).
hes not keen on antlers.

todays restock consisted of:
-large dried chicken fillets
-dried salmon skins (half for koda, shes fish crazy)
-5 dried chicken feet
-kong liver paste stuffing
-5kg worth of green beef tripe (in multiple bags, theyre his staple chew for when hes being groomed ect)
-whole air dried sprats wrapped in chicken breast

id say my favorite would be the sprats, theres something weirdly cute about those little fishy eyes :shock:
(as for the packaging i get the treats from zooplus in germany, its cheaper than ireland and they do good stuff) i used to use pig auricles but hes grown bored of them.
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Re: Chews

Post by Stacy_R » Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:24 pm

cordeliandemon wrote: i need things that have the same draw effect as a piece of fresh ham/chicken if possible, just in case he needs to be bribed into going somewhere or doing something (i dont want them trying to leash or walk him while hes there).
I'm confused...why would you not want them to leash him if they are having to "bribe him into going somewhere."? In my humble opinion, if you do not trust the kennel staff with something as basic as leashing your dog to walk him from point A to point B then you should find a different boarding facility. Realistically speaking, he SHOULD be walked...especially since he's going to be in a high stress environment. A week in a kennel situation with no mental or physical stimulation for these guys could go wrong really fast (i.e. kennel crazy) and spiral downward. Just my :twocents:
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Re: Chews

Post by Dutchringgirl » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:34 pm

. id rather him not be walked for 7 days than come home to find hes been euthanised by the dog warden for a stray mouthing or bite.
Really? That is not fair to the dog! They wont just put him down if he bit someone, if he looks like he is agitated, they will muzzle him.
quite frankly i don't trust anyone with my dogs, full stop,
You have a big problem there, good kennels will know how to handle him. I have taken my girls to a few different places and have not had any problem with the humans nor they with my girls.
but ive looked at multiple kennels and im making do with what i can.
the boarding facility in question houses the dogs in sheltered/heated sleeping areas connected to individual outdoor runs, they also have a number of secure paddocks where they let the dogs loose to play a few times a day with/without other dogs depending on temperament.
the "bribe" aspect is a bit of a fail safe in the event they need to clean out the sleeping area/run and need to move him to the opposite part, or in the event hes let loose for exercise and is stubborn to return to his kennel (his routine includes a chew for going into his stable for feeding and prevents separation tantrums when leave him for the hour to finish his food ect, so it would be preferable to continue with that)
i just want this situation to work out as smoothly and uneventful for demon as possible :) in a perfect world id never have to leave him in the first place.
I dont understand the stubborn part, they are not stubborn, they are working dogs and they want to work with the human. Now, If we were talking hounds, then I would agree, but working dogs comply.
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Re: Chews

Post by cordeliandemon » Tue Aug 04, 2015 4:34 pm

Really? That is not fair to the dog! They wont just put him down if he bit someone, if he looks like he is agitated, they will muzzle him.
its not fair but its how it works here. usually a dog can have up to three reported bites if its lucky before it legally has to be euthanized, but if its a "controlled breed" like a german shepherd,doberman, pitbull or resembles a controlled breed they dont get the luxury.
You have a big problem there, good kennels will know how to handle him. I have taken my girls to a few different places and have not had any problem with the humans nor they with my girls.
ive heard it said that ireland is 10-20 years behind the rest of the developed world when it comes to pet care /medical resources, kennels arnt an exception. not many people seem to know a whiff of dog body language or are graduates from the school of "theres no such thing as an aggressive dog, dogs dont bite, its the owners you should worry about" and "a good smack will sort him right out"
I dont understand the stubborn part, they are not stubborn, they are working dogs and they want to work with the human. Now, If we were talking hounds, then I would agree, but working dogs comply.
demon must be one in a million, hes certainly capable of being stubborn if the reward doesn't match up to the task in his eyes. if he gets bored of the usual treat for going into his stable he'll flat out refuse to enter, the same situation if hed rather stay with me than go play with koda. i wouldnt want to run and get a better treat to reward him for being cheeky so it turns into a drawn out battle of wits to convince him to get on the opposite side of the door to me. other than that he does like to do what i ask, but is able to act like a mule when it suits him. i dont like to force him or push him, hes come so far but it could easily be ruined. untill he grows up a bit its a game of patience and consistency.
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Re: Chews

Post by Owned-By-Hendrix » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:45 pm

To Tareena - I would say Himalayans last about 30 minutes to an hour, depending on how interested by dude is in it. Bully sticks, the SUPER thick ones, last about 30 minutes to an hour. Antlers or water buffalo horns if you can find them are the only things that stick around. There's a shop around here that sells split vanilla scented ones that I started him on as a puppy and he loved. My dude isn't super crazy about stuffed Kongs (he refuses to shove his insanely long tongue all the way into one) but Genuis Mikes and Busy Squirrels are completely a different story (Lord knows why). Sometimes he'll do a stuffed bone but that lasts about 15 minutes. He gets bully sticks when I need him to settle for a few minutes in "non-velco" mode and I tend to buy in bulk to make it slightly more affordable, but it's not something we do a lot.

To Cordelia - Demon is how old, a year, over a year now? I went through the same thing with H not entering his crate for anything less than X treat or Y chew, which seemed to get bigger and better as time went by. I had to start calling his bullshit. This is the age when you want to start showing them that they do have to do things they don't want to and really sticking to it despite how they play you. I listen when he says "mom, I REALLY don't want to do this" and it required really listening to him and problem solving to make sure he wasn't just being an ass. I found that generally while he didn't like the fact I was "battering down the hatches" on him, he accepted it and seemed to be happier when he realized that 1) I wasn't doing it to be an ass, 2) he got heavily praised/it benefitted him for doing what I wanted even if no immediate reward was offered, and 3) I would reinforce my say through the puppy eyes. This won't slide him backwards if you've done enough foundation and counter conditioning, and will actually help him. I started seeing a HUGE behavioral difference in H and he really started to shine. I built up the "no BS" slowly and fairly so he knew I wasn't being mean or unjust, and was simply enforcing what I told him. One of the biggest points was that I didn't take BS from him on entering crates. He quickly gave up when he realized that he was going in the crate one way or another, and me with or without bloody arms. Sounds ruthless and uncaring but in all honesty this was a serious point I was making to him after a year of crate games, desensitization, bribing with higher and higher value treats, and fighting to get him in the crate. To this day, I am the only one who could get him in a crate safely - he gives various forms of flack back to my family, his trainers, and even more so to strangers. These dudes are always testing and learning so after a certain point, you do have to show them that BS is not allowed and you are fair but firm in what you expect of them. My point is, Demon is past the age of needing higher and higher value treats for simple acts like entering his shed. While it's a good idea to build up the trust in others putting him in via treats if you haven't done so before, for you personally I would start to really analyze his behavior and decide if it's time to take one or two things and start calling "no BS" on them. Starting now and continuing to up the amount of things you won't take BS on while he grows will help so once he hits 18 months you aren't dealing with a brat dog like I had to. Talk about turning grey early!

As for the kennel, I understand this may be your only option. As many options as we have here in a major city, the only truly good ones are few and far between, so I can only imagine how hard it is to find a place for Demon. Is Koda going to be with him or is she staying with someone else? I would see if the kennel is okay with you dropping by every day this week and running OB with them and Demon, showing them how to walk him, and basically explaining he will try to be an ass, he may come up the line at you, and he will try to get his own way but negative reinforcement without a strong bond will only get you bit. In a kennel for a week, you may see an increase in fence aggression, dog aggression, OCD behavior, random barking episodes, and destructiveness as Demon tries to relieve the boredom of being in a kennel. I know he has his shed at home with you which is kennel-ish, but a kennel facility is a totally different environment he needs to be conditioned to. Especially ones that don't really interact with dogs, you'll see a lot of... interesting behaviors emerge.
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Re: Chews

Post by Dutchringgirl » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:58 pm

Owned-By-Hendrix wrote:
Sounds ruthless and uncaring
No, no its not ruthless and uncaring to call " NO BS" Its called proper training of the dog. The dog is not allowed to pull that crap. If they need to go in to the crate, they go. This is where proper training by the human comes into play so the dog learns that doing what it is asked of him is more fun and rewarding than not.. Letting dogs get away with bs will cause huge problems down the road

As for the kennel, if it is that different over there, and you may not have someone you trust to take care of him, and the biting issue is a bit scary, then I would do everything in my power to work with him as to not have these issues. If I was uncertain about leaving my dogs anywhere, then I would not leave them until I was absolutely certain there would not be any issues.
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Re: Chews

Post by cordeliandemon » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:48 pm

i just wrote my entire reply to have it disappear upon pressing submit, but here we go again :roll:

hes about 11ish months old, due his first booster vaccination in late September when he got his first one last year. i had the same situation demon is in with koda when she was his age. it progressed similarly to how it did with H.
first it was a treat to go outside. then two treats, three, a piece of ham, chunk of meat ect until eventually i was wrestling on the ground with a 38kg fanged slinky just to get her out the door.
now shes at the point where i just use the "angry" voice (not louder, just a lower tone) and she'll march right out and not pass the threshold even if i leave the door wide open.
ive been making positive associations with demon going outside but now its reaching the point of "take the treat or not youre still going outside mister"
for two days in a row ive managed to get him to go out to koda efficiently but i have to wait and see if it continues to work.
he was being a brat as i tried put him out to play with koda so i got the idea to pour some of my water on his back, he immediately ran to where he was supposed to be then got cuddles and praise through the latch access hole in the door once it was closed behind him. its worked without fail since so im hoping it sticks and he'll eventually just need a warning now and then like it did with the spray bottle and jumping on people.
its essentially the same way i sorted koda out only she had an e-collar set to vibrate when she got sassy and demon gets soaked a little.
its the early stages of correction so the treat bribes will still be the best option for when hes in the kennels.

unfortunately kodas too food aggressive to stay in the kennels with demon so shes being looked after by a family friend. ive set an appointment to visit the boarding facility this thursday to go over demons needs, how they move the dogs into the paddocks ect and generally scope the place out more.
its not a huge operation and in a rural area so it'll be calmer than most, they have a max of 20 dogs and i got a large kennel booked with only a couple weeks to spare so they cant be at max capacity.
when demon went to be boarded and trained for a week and ended up attacking the trainers when they walked him (luckily they had bite suits) i expected him to have some issues when he got home but he weirdly ended up being gentler and more loving with me than ever before. ill definitely still be prepared for bad behavior when i get him back this time though.
Dutchringgirl wrote:
As for the kennel, if it is that different over there, and you may not have someone you trust to take care of him, and the biting issue is a bit scary, then I would do everything in my power to work with him as to not have these issues. If I was uncertain about leaving my dogs anywhere, then I would not leave them until I was absolutely certain there would not be any issues.
i really wish not leaving was an option. the week will be torture, hopefully more for me than him.
no doubt itll be sorted eventually.
hes definitely got the potential to be a lovely and trustworthy dog, its just a long road.
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Re: Chews

Post by Owned-By-Hendrix » Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:11 pm

You could try him staying for a day and overnight visit to see how he takes to the kennel to. He may adjust faster once he realizes it's not a sudden interruption to his life but rather something that just happens.

That's good. Is he still collar sensitive? I know you were having problems with the chain leash and I think the choke collar...? How does he do when others handle him? As long as he doesn't go crazy when another person handles him and the kennel isn't doing like intensive training/handling/crazy stuff he should be fine. When H was in a kennel for two days at a facility, the walls were solid and he could only look at the dog across the aisle from him, which apparently they hated each other, so fence fighting (from across a 7 foot aisle) was his entertainment, as was attempting to each the wire. Basically, he was bored and lonely and did whatever he could to relieve the stress. Demon may prefer the kennel and as long as all are safe, it's all good, you know?
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Re: Chews

Post by cordeliandemon » Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:03 pm

hes slowly getting better with the collar , i still warn people hes "claustrophobic" if theyre petting him so they dont touch his neck too much. he has a julius k9 power harness that he behaves and acts calmer in but theres still a bit of a panic wiggling seizure trying to escape when its being put on/taken off so i dont let anyone else handle him with it.

luckily there are no kennels facing eachother in this place so he should be okish, hes a devil for trying to gnaw through his runs chainlink fence if something frustrates him nearby (its so warped it looks like a great white shark lives in there). hes out with koda for the alot of the day/night nowadays and shes really teaching him to turn off and chill. its not uncommon to see him lazing about in the sun or snoozing with her during the day now, hopefully he wont be constantly amped up in this place as a result.

im not sure if shes influenced by him or its something hormonal after the spay but kodas become just as fence aggressive as demon. she used to just be dog aggressive on walks but now she patrols her garden, pees like a male dog raising her leg on everything and wants to eat anything she hears or sees beyond the fence including people. i wont even start with how she guards me and snarls/bares her teeth at anyone who jokingly raises their voice nearby :yernuts: just plain weird for a malamute.
hopefully he does ok in this place, it would be great if he could be released into a paddock to play with other large dogs. ill have to check their method of bringing them from a-b tomorrow(on the site there are photos of some collarless dogs playing in the paddocks, so they might just be herded in)
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Re: Chews

Post by Raven » Thu Aug 06, 2015 4:05 am

How long have you had Demon now?
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Re: Chews

Post by cordeliandemon » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:30 am

ill have had him a year on the 27th of September,
i may have underestimated his age by a couple weeks, according to his microchip his birthday will be on the 14th of this month :)
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Koda (alaskan malamute)
Sidney (collie/springer spaniel)- R.I.P

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Re: Chews

Post by Dutchringgirl » Thu Aug 06, 2015 1:49 pm

cordeliandemon wrote: it would be great if he could be released into a paddock to play with other large dogs.
has he been around other dogs? You cant just put him in a play group with out knowing how he is in a new place with a herd of new dogs. They day care is like a dog park, not a good situation, except you dont have all of the clueless humans around. Each dog thinks its their place and their stuff.
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