Crating puppy

[Nico]

Hi everyone,
I promise photos soon! I just wanted to pose a few questions regarding the crate. I got Cola a crate, placed her favorite things on chew on inside leave the door open and she has started to go in and lay down of her own volition. I have read differing opinions on when crating is appropriate. Some people say not to crate the puppy when you leave he house, to only keep her confined in a safe room, when I depart to go pick up food or whatever. I have also heard the opposite; crate your puppy when you leave so she wont get into trouble. She has become super attached to me and she cries when I leave her in the other room even while I shower, so I am thinking she better learn quickly to spend some time alone. yesterday was her first day in Brooklyn and she was a bit overwhelmed and off her/my schedule. Starting this morning here is my proposed schedule for her.

8:00 am - Feed
8:20 am - Walk for 20 mins (if she has not gone to the bathroom in that time bring her back upstairs and crate her for 20 minutes and then try outside again)

after pooping reward her, go to the park and play for 45- 1 hour.

1:00 pm - Feed
1:20 pm - Walk outside for 20 mins etc etc so on and so forth....

6:00 and 6:20 repeat....

I understand the benefit of the crate in house training her but I dont want her to think of it as a punishment. I also want her to be able to chill out there when needed.

today is day 2, I have been spending the last 48 hours bonding with her and am just beginning to have a schedule coagulate. I really appreciate any feedback or tips. thanks a mil!

[felixone123]

can't wait to see puppy pics!!

Only you are thinking of the crate as punishment. This will be her safe haven and a place for her to chill whenever she wants to go there. Keep the crate door open when is she interacting with you. And definitely crate her when you go out. You can also crate her with the door close when she is not interacting with you this way she can get used to being alone.

Get crate games video by Susan Garrett - I'm pretty sure it was already suggested as a "must" have. And, personally I like the Ruff Love book and program, also by Susan.

There are way more experienced people on here to give their input. Good luck and have fun!!

[leih merigian]

Nico,

I'd switch things around a bit. Her heavier exercise should be before she's fed. So, get up in the am, take her out immediately to do her business, come back in, get yourself together, train a bit (like a couple of minutes), play/exercise, then feed her breakfast. Take her out again (you'll learn her schedule as far as eliminations go..some puppies need to go immediately after eating, others take a little while), then back in the crate.

You're right, you don't want to create a dog that can't be left alone. For puppies, I like to crate them for a few hours in the am, after the first round above, then out again mid day, same sort of things, another confined time in the afternoon, out again for their dinner session, then the evening is up to you. I use a lot of crates plus an Xpen with my pups, so I have a huge wire crate in the front room (it'll be a while before she understands how to chill in the evening with you, and you may not want to teach her that she gets to have your full attention in the evening quiet hours ,so a crate or Xpen in the living room comes in handy, plus a nice chewy), an Xpen in the kitchen, where I spend the lion's share of my time with my pup, and a crate in the bedroom.

I was able to put the Xpen away when Geyser was 10 months old, and by 17 months, she was responsible enough to be left alone uncrated when I'm gone. She never destroyed one single thing. Well, not counting stuffed toys .

[Dutchringgirl]

They wont see the crate as a punishment if you dont use it as a punishment. I never got mad at them then put them in the crate. If I knew a situation would be coming up where I couldnt watch them or I needed space or quiet, they went in with happy attitude and toys. If at night Sadie was too crazy and wouldnt settle then she had quiet time in her crate, but it still wasnt punishment, in a happy way I would put her in there so she wouldnt feel it was a punishment.

[Nico]

thanks guys. that all makes a lot of sense. I don't/won't think of the crate as punishment. Though sometimes it is hard hearing those yelps!

Leih, thank you very much for the input on scheduling. I really appreciate it.

[Sugars Mom]

On the first night we got our puppy, she didn't like to be in the crate and be left alone, (and yes, the crying was painful - for me) but I realized that if I was beside her when she was in the crate, she was ok. So from the first night on, her crate went next to our bed at night. In the day, we had it in whatever room we were in.

You can feed her in it to help her get used to being in it and having positive experiences in it. Other then the first hour on that first night we got her, mine was totaly fine with the crate. Of course, as she got older, we could leave the room with her in her crate and she was fine with it. Waiting until she is relaxed and settled in the crate before leaving will really help alot too. Around 7 or 8 months we were able to leave the door open on her crate and trust her when we were asleep at night or if we left the house for a bit. (We work at home so it is not often that we have to leave her at all tho.)

[Choochi]

I also put the puppy's crate in the bedroom at first this way they're still fairly close to you at night and can get some comfort from that. Then when I feel they're ready I move their crate to where they will ultimately be.

I also have crates in the car (all my dogs ride crated) so some times instead of leaving the pup alone in a crate at home, I will put them in the crate in the car and take them along for any errands. Of course weather being a factor, use your judgement. I find they get used to being in a crate in a car MUCH faster then in the house, maybe the car motion is soothing to them, who knows, but they get to "practice" being in a crate "alone" since the crate is in the back and they can't see me although I'm sure they can smell me and can certainly hear me.

[HeatherH]

I'm new to crating myself. Dutch is only around 5 months. We started crating him when we were out. Better so that he doesn't get into trouble. it also help them to learn to hold their bladder longer. they're not going to mess in their crate and risk sitting in there with it. Remember dog's feel shame when they know they've done something wrong.

As for the separation it will help them soothes a bit with their favorite toys and a blanky in there. It seriously gives me peace of mind when I'm sleeping at night and he not wondering a get into anything.

A dog that knows his boundry is a happier dog.

Heather

[Nico]

Ok, I may be labeled marshmallow for this, but I am crating her when I am out and never for longer than 3 hours, but at night I am letting her sleep in the bed with me. She cries so loudly when she gets crated right now that when I go out I can hear her several houses down. i do live in Brooklyn so that isn't TOO far but it means everyone else can hear her too.
Lieh, I followed your advice this morning and it worked out great! 1st thing in the morning, brought her out to do her thing and she did, like a champ! i was very proud. That makes 3 consecutive poos outside. The little girl is learning. I am sure the treats she is receiving are helping out with that. we did a few minutes of training while she was hungry and she was sitting after 3 reps with treats. Even kept it up so I could show my wife. Though I just tried doing a sit without a treat about ten minutes ago and she wasn't hearing me.
I fed her after a little going up and down stairs and some tug o war with an old shirt that has been donated to the cause, and brought her outside immediately. This time she was trepidatious coming down the stairs and I had to pretend like i was going to walk off and she followed me. Once we were outside she didnt want to walk anywhere, whined and kept trying to go into our fron yard under the fence. basically she was trying to get me to bring her home and had enough of outside for the time being.
it took her about an hour to eliminate from the time of her meal and when she did it she went on the stairs headed down towards the door, which i took as a sign that she new that that is the direction we go in when she needs to poop or piss. previous to this there have been several times she has made it to the bottom of the stairs when we are headed out and pees in front of the door. hahaha. I dont scold her for these because I think she is moving in the right direction and I want to be generally positive with her at 10 weeks and teach her through positive reinforcement not corrections.
sooooo thats where we are today. on the photo note I cant seem to get them to load straight, keep coming out sideways!

[leih merigian]

Ok, I may be labeled marshmallow for this, but I am crating her when I am out and never for longer than 3 hours, but at night I am letting her sleep in the bed with me. She cries so loudly when she gets crated right now that when I go out I can hear her several houses down.

You are making a big mistake here, dude. She has not earned the priviledge of sleeping in bed with you yet. And, you never EVER let her out of her crate when she's making a fuss. NEVER. All you are teaching her by doing so is that if she fusses loud enough and long enough, you'll let her out, and maybe even let her up on the bed with you.

Put her crate right next to your bed, and if she won't be quiet after about 10 minutes, cover it with a sheet. Then give her a while longer (5-10 minutes) and if she still won't shut up, pick up the crate and take her to a room that's far enough from your bedroom that you won't hear her fussing. Close all the doors between you and her room. Do not give her any attention at all when she's making noise in the crate. Don't look at her, don't reassure yer, nothing. Totally ignore her.

She's no doubt very smart, and she'll get it fairly quickly, as long as you are firm about it. You have to stop thinking of the crate as anything but a positive place/thing. You are the boss of her, not the other way around. You are the only one who can explain that to her, by how you behave.

Behavior that is reinforced is repeated. And, behavior has consequences. Everything you do with her is training. She's learning the house rules, and what it means to share her life with you guys. The only way she learns all that stuff is if you explain it to her, mostly thru "this is the consequence for that behavior" (she behaves, she gets to sleep in her crate next to you; she doesn't, she's ostracized, etc etc etc).

[Dutchringgirl]

For the crate = punnishment theory, are you thinking that if she is in the crate and she is crying that she feels like she is being punnished? Or are you just feeling bad?

[feraloup]

I have a separate "time-out" corner for Moko when he's naughty that is different from his crate. I've almost never had to use it, though, as most of the time I don't give him opportunities for getting into trouble.

On the crating thing, he definitely considers it "home-base" and when we are out and about and he's feeling insecure, he will actually very eagerly jump up on the back of my jeep (where his crate is when we're running errands and the like,) when we return with obvious relief. "Lemme in lemme in!!!"

He also will go in there and curl up on his own when he's sleepy.

His crate comes with us in the car, and when at home it's in the kitchen.

After successful potty outings he gets to play loose for a bit in the (gated off and puppy-proofed) kitchen. If unsupervised he is crated.

I do let him out of the crate if he ki-yi's and fusses, but only to go out for a potty break, and if he doesn't go, immediately back in the crate!

I'll wait a little and try again, repeat. If he does go potty outside, then he gets a few minutes of play or snuggles before being returned to the crate.

If he has JUST successfully pottied, had his reward time, and is still making noise, then I ignore him, because I know he's not needing to go out for bathrooming.

He's been sick and had tummy/bowel trouble, so I haven't been able to use food rewards and haven't been wanting to ignore crying, even if it's only one hour after he last went, because odds have been that it IS legitimate need.

As exhausting as it's been, the bonus is that he's been quick to learn that "take care of business" means "we're out here to potty, do it" and that crying gets him outside, but not just for play, as if he doesn't produce he's back in the crate. So he's very good at signalling when he needs out, now. He also knows that he gets ignored if he's crying for any reason other than going out.

I did let him sleep with me the night I was doing post-vet vigil and he needed meds and fluids and stuff every hour, but he wasn't snuggling with me because he made noise, I initiated it when he was already quiet.

I do sympathize with the dificulty of worrying about noise for others... I have a 5 year old child who is a bear without rest, and my fiancee who is also grumpy when tired, and my fiancee's brother who lives downstairs is a bake and needs to get up at an asinine early hour and shouldn't have to listen to late-night noise.

I actually, 2 night early on, when he was screeching and I knew he didn't need to go out, put his crate in the jeep for an hour, then returned his crate to the kitchen when he was quiet. I only had to do this twice, on two nights. That nicely made the house quiet for the others who needed sleep, and he learned that when he was quiet, he got to be in the warm kitchen, and when he's screechy, he's isolated and cold. (I wouldn't do this now, as it's getting too cold, but we had a few warmish nights two weeks ago that were perfect. Not as nice as inside the house, but not cold enough that I was worried about his health and body regulation temperature -wise.

Now, he's great about only crying to be let out if he needs it, and if he starts up just for attention, (rare now,) a simple "hush!" Is enough to make him settle down with a disgruntled grunt as a last word and then no more noise.