What specific lines carry small framed Dutch Shepherds?

[F PORT]

Hi,
I am new to this site and not knowledgeable in the lines of this breed. I have trained working GSDs for years in Personal Protection as a hobby (presently have a medium sized eleven month old male GSD in training) and I am looking for a small framed Dutchie for my son to train. I train next to some individuals whose Dutchies are just a little smaller than my GSD, and I could purchase their pups, but I definitely want something on the smaller size. I have had two medium sized dogs in the past and it was a hassle. The pup/dog will be a family member in our house alongside our GSD and train on the weekends.
In all breeds there are always lines that produce smaller framed dogs, what are the specific lines I should be looking at, and who are the reputable breeders?
I appreciate any input, and hope to share my experiences in the future.

Frank
cb1100f@optonline.net
Long Island, N.Y.

[vneerland]

Welcome Frank from Long island.

As for your question. Small framed is relative. There are people who (say they) have 90 to 100 lbs DS's but they are really supposed to be in the 50-70 lbs range. (70 being large for the standard) That does not answer your question, I know, but I am sure you know to select for correct sized parents, if you want a correct sized pup.
With that being said: I am NOT sure that a DS is a good choice for a beginning handler, assuming that your son is. No matter how much experience you as the father have, it does not prepare him (or you?) for the speed of these brindle beasts. They are not (supposed to be) smaller sized GSD's. They can be much faster and have way more drive.

[k9katet]

Maybe get a full grown adult with drive appropriate for your son from rescue?

[F PORT]

I had both, a malinois(bitch) and a dutchie(male) in the past, so I do have experience in training them, just don't follow their breeding lines. I would prefer a 50lb male/female that has a clear head and settles down when need be. And Yes, definitely on the small side, but definitely a lot of fun being quick and light.

[Dutchringgirl]

Look for low drive. Thalie was an import from France and super low drive and small. She still was great at Ring Sport but wasnt going to set the world on fire.
Maybe talk to some breeders and tell them what you are looking for. Thalie is small and super level headed and quiet, I dont work her with my kids only because she was trained to me and wont listen to them. They get so frustrated. But, even when I get on her really good she will turn to eat me, I wouldn't want her to do that with the kids. I would suggest talking to some good breeders and really explain to them what you are looking for.

[Choochi]

I don't think you can necessarily sum this up neatly into lines. My male is from KNPV lines who are known for larger size and he's barely over 50lbs and short little thing (but he makes up for this in attitude and would not in any way be a good match for a kid). His dad and brothers are in the 80lb range. I've seen other pups his size come out of normal sized parents, but again don't think the size automatically made them easy to handle. I know some of them were returned for being too aggressive even for an experienced handler. I think you should be looking for the temperament, get a few feelers out there with breeders who produce the type of dog you want for your son, and THEN add the criteria of size. The small ones do pop up here and there but I don't think you can reliably predict this until the litter is on the ground and growing. I also think as mentioned that your best would be to approach rescue or look for an older pup or fully grown adult.

And if you're thinking of the smaller dog for your son because he's a small kid, keep in mind how fast they grow. Don't know how old your son is, but if he can handle a 50lb dog now, he'll be able to handle an 80lb dog in the next 1-2yrs while the dog's personality will be there for 10yrs or more. I personally wouldn't be too hang up on the dog's size. Heck, I'm 95lbs (about the size of a kid ) and handle a 120lb corso. Yes, I have to ask for help in holding him for any agitation work on the harness but beyond that my control of him comes from training and we do just fine.

[Christie M]

Hi there,

First, can you please visit the User control Panel and create a signature including your name?? That helps us keep everyone separate

Picking a pup on lines can be really hard. Obviously, females tend to be smaller. I have had 2 litters (and own 1 pup out of a third) out of Titan, FR3 in CT. I love the bidability that he throws. Just strong, handler sensitive pups. Very trainable to the highest levels of anything, provided you give them the time to mature and come into themselves. Out of the 3 litters, there were consistently females who were at or below the 50# mark. Salix and Balis (2 females that I have) are 46# and 42# respectively. I don't consider them good examples of the breed in the slightest, but they make fin performance dogs. Additionally, a female we placed on Tenn Hwy Patrol this past summer was 53#. All three dogs are out of different females from completely different lines. So that is the only specific dog that I can speak of for small framed females.

[Mark77]

I was a beginning handler last August when I got my first Dutch Shepherd. I had owned dogs prior just never trained them for anything and never owned a DS dog. So basically I was a newb to the whole thing. I enlisted the help of a local trainer who has people come into his training facility and works with the animals along with their owners on a weekly basis. This trainer has worked with several K9 departments in the area and is well versed with Schuetzen, just not KNPV. For me that didn't matter, I have no allusions of grandeur awaiting me- I just wanted a well trained animal. I now have a great dog who not only loves to be around people, enjoys going to parties and visiting folks- but also, is extremely well behaved. I don't kennel him at all, he has complete run of the house and I rarely have any issues other than once in a while he might pull a towel from the rack to play with it.