Dutch Shepherd Forum

Would those of you with lots of dog training experienced mind sharing how you taught your DSes bring it and drop it?

Zane is a quick learner generally - in just a few months he's picked up sit, wait, down, leave it, come, up (to get on the sofa), shake, look at me (great for distracting him from squirrels), and is learning wave and roll over (he can only go over onto one side now, we have another 270 degrees of rolling to go, but he's very good at the 90 degrees of roll he can do!) - and is reliable on all of them in the house or on the street. At the dog park, he's not always so good with his commands (I only use them when I know I can enforce them and won't get mobbed by other dogs wanting treats, so he gets less practice) but we're working on it.

I've never had another dog that I've had to teach how to play fetch (they just figure it out) - he loves it but doesn't quite do it right, and some quirks of his toy vs food preferences are making it hard to figure out how to teach him. He usually prefers toys to food, unless we're doing a training session or it's time for dinner, and then food wins. What that means is that I can't effectively mix toys and food when trying to train him because he gets excited about one or the other, but never both at the same time. So, giving him a treat as a reward for bringing and dropping a ball rarely works. But using two toys at a time (my current strategy) isn't working that well because he's too wound up about all the toys to focus properly on the training.

He's pretty good at fetching in the house, and will usually bring a ball to you and drop it if asked (sometimes I wind up sitting with my hand in his mouth for 15 minutes waiting for him to loosen his grip on a ball, but try to make sure I always walk away with what I asked for). But, he does sometimes wander off in the middle of playing fetch to go sit in his crate and chew on his ball, and I let him do that.

At the park it's a different story - he loves running after balls and will drop it (but usually 2 yards or more away from me) if I ask him to while holding another ball to throw for him. Sometimes he just runs after the ball and drops it near where it landed (50 ft or more away). When the ball is really far away, I've been doing the "where's your ball?" routine and walking him over to it, getting him to pick it up, and walking back over to my spot in the park to drop it for me. He's ok at that - doesn't always get it, but mostly - but the drop it can wind up far away from me even so because he starts running after the new ball before dropping the old one.

So, I need to get him to bring the ball/toy closer, and also get him to do a more reliable, standing in place drop it. As we've been working on drop it, I've made sure he either gets his favorite treats (if we're practicing with a non-toy item, say something he's stolen from the recycling bin) or gets the toy right back after giving it to me, but somehow it's not getting through to him, so maybe I'm doing something wrong or not being consistent enough?

Thanks for any tips you have!

I am definitely no expert in training DS's. I use two identical squeaky objects that are ONLY available when we are working on fetch and drop.

I throw one and wait until she has the other in her grasp. Then I start to squeak the one i have. IT becomes the fun one one and she runs right up and drops the other at my feet. If she doesn't drop it near me I act like an idiot that can not possible figure out how to get to that ball WAY over there. It took a while the first time but after that she would humor me. Now she has no problem.

If she doesn't bring it back, but starts to play with the other one I have lots of fun with MY ball and run away from her. She can't resist.

Just a newbies .

First, break it down into smaller pieces. Separate the fetching and bringing from the dropping.

You've got the right idea about the two toy thing (it's best if they're pretty similar or identical items). Instead of throwing the one toy way far for the pup to fetch, try just playing with the two toys...drop one pretty near to you, encourage your pup to get it, then produce the other toy, make it very exciting, as soon as your pup drops the one it has, it gets the new one. Get very excited about every part of this game. And, stop way before your dog's had enough (letting him take the ball away and just play with it himself isn't helping you at all, but you already know that ). You always want to quit while they're still very engaged with you and eager for more.

You can define a drop zone for the dog, which you first have to define/decide on for yourself . I don't play this way any more (drop the toy on the floor/ground), but I used to with an eariler dog, and I defined the drop zone as a semi circle around my feet. These days, I much prefer to have the toy delivered to my hand. But that's simply personal preference, and teaching an "out" (or "drop" or whatever verbal cue you will use) is a good thing to do regardless.

As your dog gets better at this game, you can gradually toss the toy farther away from you. It sounds like you need to keep the excitement level high for this pup.

Also, I don't know how old your pup is, but my DS wasn't a natural retriever, either. We worked at it, and over time, it became one of her favorite things to do. Just keep the sessions really short and VERY VERY fun and exciting. And, anytime your pup seems more interested in chewing on the toy than doing what you want, it's time to get something else out and play a different game. You don't want him practicing a behavior you don't want to encourage.

(BTW, congratulations on all the other stuff you're working on!)

Thanks, these are really helpful replies! From what you've wrote, I think I'm mostly on the right track, but not being consistent/strict enough about what I want from him, so he gets confused and/or defaults to whatever he feels like doing.

The wandering off thing is funny, I think I just have the most mellow DS in the universe. We can have one or two fetches in the house and then he's off to his crate to have a chew, no matter how much fun I'm having with his other squeaky ball. He will fetch in the park forever though, so I guess I just need to work on it there.

Thalie will wander off too, but usually after a really long time of playing, then she will just go of and chew her toy.

I had trained Thalie for an "apport" like a fetch, for Ring, I started with her on a leash in a heal, but you could have her where ever, then just tossed the ball, her favorite, toss it close you you, when she gets it, give the leash a tug back to you so she knows to come back, I had Thalie come to a sit right in front of me, but as long as the dog comes back, then if she holds the ball, just put your hand on it (if you dare) and say out, or what ever word you want to use, Thalie had a good out so she did but with Sadie, who will die before letting go, I grab the scruff of her neck and say "out" and dont let go of her scruff until she does, then its the happy dance.

Dutchringgirl wrote:I grab the scruff of her neck and say "out" and dont let go of her scruff until she does, then its the happy dance.

LOL. And that would get me eaten by Ziva.

Christie M wrote:

Dutchringgirl wrote:I grab the scruff of her neck and say "out" and dont let go of her scruff until she does, then its the happy dance.

LOL. And that would get me eaten by Ziva.

um....... hmm, ok, only attempt scruff grabbing when no humans will be consumed.

Just an update on our progress with bring (drop it is still iffy) - Zane will now bring the ball all the way back, all the time at the park if I'm sitting on one particular bench. He won't do it reliably if I'm standing or if I'm on another bench, so I guess we still have some work to do. But, still, progress!

Ya, progress! Sugar just seemed to "get it" one day...I would have no problem in the house with her fetching, giving, or dropping, but outside, all bets were off. Too many distractions. Outside she would fly off after the ball but then not bring it back, or would bring it back 2 or 3 times then catch a wiff of something interesting it would distract her. But then one day, boom, she consistently fetched and dropped for half an hour at the park!

Keep working at it, you seem to be on the right track!

That is so great that it is going better! I swear the pickier I am the better things get here!

Xena has just started to bring things on command tis week! on our walks she will play with her toy, then drop it and keep walking. Well I stopped picking them up for her and told her to "bring it". She would bring it and drop it on my feet. Not good enough. She has to hand them to me and if i (butter fingers) don't catch it she has to pick it up and hand it again. THEN and only then does she get a treat.

Well yesterday the cat found a stray AAA battery and miss Xena checked it out. I said "bring it" and she did! And today a rubber band fell out of the truck as we were getting out and she brought it too!

My being a hard a$$ is really paying off!

Lauren wrote: Well yesterday the cat found a stray AAA battery and miss Xena checked it out. I said "bring it" and she did! And today a rubber band fell out of the truck as we were getting out and she brought it too!

That is awesome! We still have a long way to go before Zane is that helpful.

If it makes you feel better, she rolls her eyes like "lazy american" while she does it. It is not with a helpful heart!

You're both doing great...keep up the good work!

Remember to get so jazzed when they do things for you...Geyser will now find something on the floor, like a penny, and just pick it up and bring it to me when I'm busy with something else. She knows I'll be very happy and that she'll get some kind of reward.

Next assignment: teach your dog the difference between "show me" and "get it." This comes in handy when you, say, drop a pill on the floor .

This is one of those long string things... first, teach a nose touch to your flat hand (the palm). I just use "nose" as a cue, and you can shape this, as opposed to luring or whatever. (So, put your palm in front of their face, they move their head towards it, mark/reward. Soon they'll touch it with their nose, mark/reward, party. Keep doing that and when you know they'll do it, say "nose" first...that starts adding the verbal cue. They get this quickly, as it's fun and soon you can start moving your hand around, high, low, sideways, make them rear up for it, go down for it, etc. Incidently, this is one of those behaviors you can use for a distraction in public, as it's very easy to do and you can stand there and do nose touches for a long time, if you need to distract your dog.)

OK, so you've got a nose touch down. Next, take a toy or something, hold it out, and say "nose," and reward the correct response. Once they'll touch anything you hold out and give that cue for...you can morph it to "show me...nose," and then eventually, you drop the nose and just say "show me," if you want them to touch something to indicate it, but not pick it up. So drop different things on purpose and ask them to show you. Etc.

Now you can drop a pill, or something else you may want help finding, but don't want them to eat it or pick it up. Bingo

Thanks Leih, we'll start working on nose to work up to show me, that's not one I knew about! This board is so inspiring - we got Zane as a mystery breed rescue and so weren't thinking about really advanced training with him at first, but there are so many great things to teach these dogs that we'll keep on going!

Yes, thanks Leih, the nose thing is a great thing to teach. I'm going to start teaching that right away!

yes, thanks for the nose touch. sounds easy enough. going to teach it to Odin.

felixone123 wrote:yes, thanks for the nose touch. sounds easy enough. going to teach it to Odin.

Great! It's very easy, and this is exactly the kind of stuff you want to start out with for him...building your relationship is your main goal right now. Easy stuff will help a lot with that .

Wow I thought Ozzy was the only dog in the world that didn't know how to play fetch! We will definitely try these techniques. Love this board, I get so much inspiration.

Kgazlay wrote:Wow I thought Ozzy was the only dog in the world that didn't know how to play fetch!

Dont worry, Sadie isnt too swift on the fetch game either, She is so busy barking at Thalie.