Dutch Shepherd Forum

I'd really like to get input on this one. Especially because it's what caused the family that adopted me to drag me back to the shelter after 3 days. My foster mom told them it could happen. She gave them a list of behaviors I experienced during my first several months in my foster home and how during a (stressful) transition to a new home could possibly reoccur.

At about 16 months old now, she has just recently displayed guarding behavior, including aggressive warning barks. It's rare when I'm around--in fact, I've only seen it once, briefly.

Perhaps what Hilde experienced was a bit different than me. My scenario was that I'd be laying near my 14-year old girl and when my foster mom came home/entered the room I'd vocalize with growls or barks seeming more on the aggressive side. It was suggested that perhaps I had a treasured bone nearby but in each occurrence that didn't seem to be the case. Advice from professional trainers was a big help 1) let sleeping dogs lie - don't encroach in tight places 2) use a cue such as "touch" to lure me out if needed 3) don't react - ignore all undesired behavior 4) reward positive behavior (I was given a click/treat each time she walked by and I didn't react).

I'm still not sure why I did it, stress for sure. My foster mom came to think Sudden Environmental Change and over arousal where contributors. As well as the fact that if I have stress during the day (even happy stress is stress) it can affect my behavior later in the day.

Well, Hilde's guarding isn't even remotely a problem. It's only ever been in appropriate situations. I'm just glad she's showing some protection behavior, because usually she'll just lick anyone that gets close enough. I tell Elizabeth that Hilde senses her weakness/vulnerability and knows to defend her. She tells me Hilde just doesn't like me enough to bother defending me. Our former dog (Finnish Spitz) was similar--more defensive of Elizabeth. I'm sure there's something in our behaviors that the dogs pick up on to make these decisions.

Maybe something similar is happening in Debbie's case. She has an instinctive need to "protect" and senses that the girl is somehow vulnerable. (Just guessing here!) Considering the girl's age, maybe Debbie feels the tension that can often exist between a teenager and her parent and is trying to prevent it. Or maybe she's just comfortable with the girl and is resisting being forced out of that zone.

I've heard that while DS will integrate into the entire family, they tend to form a strong bond with a single member. The jury's still out on that bond in our house. Do the three of you spend much time all together just hanging out? Does she show a special bond with the girl?

I surmised that Debbie was just comfortable with Sarah (14) and resisted being forced out of that zone. She did the same thing with our caged rabbit: was laying comfortably and when I approached she got up and made some noise. We kept him in the laundry room with the door closed so when the door was open that was indeed a coveted spot. When Debbie first came to us we tried not to put her in situations where she was likely to misbehave. That meant little time with Sarah (socks, shoes, clothes, stuffed toys, pens/pencils, books, abound). Therefore I could see how time with Sarah was coveted. Seems strange that Debbie would be protect against "scary" me...her primary caregiver and food provider!

The jury's still out on that bond in our house. She has a bond with each of us, including my 20 year old son who is sometimes here, sometimes not. She definitely cherishes Sarah as she gets to sleep on her bed.

Debbie's been with us for quite a while now so she has indeed developed a sense of familiarity and comfort as well as family bonds.

I think an additional problem with her adoptive family is that she was on edge and had not fully developed a sense of trust. Even though I explained at length as did the Humane Society, the family seemed clueless about the need to transition and Debbie only lasted 3 days. The wife couldn't understand why Debbie was so cuddly and loving all the times she met with her yet at times when she approached Debbie would make some noise. The first time was late at night (Debbie's first night!) when Debbie was curled up on the husband's side of the bed and instead of letting her be the wife approached wanting to pet her. Another time was when Debbie was snuggled up on the floor near the teenage girl, and made some noise when the wife approached instead of just letting her be. Seems to be cases of Debbie resisting being forced out of a zone.

An interesting question is whether Debbie has a protective side. For the most part she'll lay down, look up, then lift the back leg for belly rub mode.

AdoptableDebbieDog wrote: The first time was late at night (Debbie's first night!) when Debbie was curled up on the husband's side of the bed and instead of letting her be the wife approached wanting to pet her. Another time was when Debbie was snuggled up on the floor near the teenage girl, and made some noise when the wife approached instead of just letting her be. Seems to be cases of Debbie resisting being forced out of a zone.

An interesting question is whether Debbie has a protective side. For the most part she'll lay down, look up, then lift the back leg for belly rub mode.

Sounds like a guarding issue..."my bed", "my girl"... sounds like she is claiming things as hers. That is an issue to deal with for sure and think of it this way, if the potential adopters don't know how to deal with this or don't want to put the in the time to do so, they probably aren't the right adopters for this dog.

Guarding people/spaces

I always get confused by Dutch. Generally you'd think that he's my husband's dog if you were outside looking in. By that I mean he listens to my husband and follows him around and will duck behind him if he's scared. It's kind of funny because I only feed him dog food my husband will feed him what he's eating. He looks at him for his nightly walk. But he sticks to my side and will wait till I go to bed. If I leave for a week or overnight he always gets up and touches me all night to make sure I'm still here. I'm the one that travel in my house. I'm the one that will travel with him too. He's never more than 10 feet away from me. Always touching me in one way or another.
With me he's more protective and will get nasty with Greg if he lets me leave by myself " like look she's leaving OMG". We've actually had people staring at us when we're out and about because he doesn't know what to do or who to guard if we're not in the same place. For example if we have guests over and I go to the kitchen and Greg's in the living room with the guests. Dutch is all over the place. He's more exhausted at the end of the night.
As he gets out of his puppy stage he's more guarding of the property and sound more like a dog then pup so it's not so cute now.
Of his stuff he and the cat will compete for space but Dutch is not a danger to her he keeps getting corrected and she instigates too some times. He will growl a little if you try to take something away from him but he's learned not to take it too far. He has never gotten nasty about us taking things from him (food bones etc.) which is good.
He has his own spot he's not allowed up on furniture period.
Heather

I've never had any experiences with guarding until Debbie so I'm especially interested in hearing other DS stories regarding guarding.

Thanks for writing. Dutch seems to have a great personality! And is very loyal!

One thing in particular: the former family immediately allowed Debbie on the bed. I think that should be something allowed after a solid foundation (and then that privilege is earned) and then only via invitation. Just sayin'...it may not have helped or may have helped confused matters for her.

Sorry if Debbie did not explain more clearly. She has two separate behaviors that could be viewed as problematic for an adopter.

1) She's curled up sleeping, at night, generally in a tight corner (or twice in the hallway when she was curled up sleeping in front of a bedroom door). When a person approaches she gives a "grrrrrrr" and might lift a lip. This has happened during her transition time with us, once after she had been with us for a while but after a hugely stressful day, and during the 3 days before the adopter returned her.

2) Debbie would be laying under the table near my 14 year old daughter and when I'd approached Debbie would vocalize with growls or barks seeming more on the aggressive side. Also, Debbie would position herself in between my daughter and I. This mostly happened during her early transition. Back then I took care because I had no idea if Debbie was prone to bite (she has never bitten).

One thing in particular: the former family immediately allowed Debbie on the bed. I think that should be something allowed after a solid foundation (and then that privilege is earned) and then only via invitation.

How wise you are! That's essentially what we did when Debbie first came to us. The Humane Society told us to use positive reinforcement training so we kept her in areas of the house where she would likely be more successful. It was quite awhile before she was allowed in any bedroom. (After 6 months I finally gave in and she's allowed on my daughter's bed but Debbie does know the cue "4 on the floor" to signal her getting off the bed).

With the adopters, the actual situation was Debbie's first night she was curled up at night, between the husband's side of the bed and the wall (not on the bed). Surely she had had a very stressful day and deserved to be left alone.

If anyone has input on protectiveness/aggression/assertiveness/bossiness or "leave me alone!" behavior with a human approaching, I'd love to hear.