I was talking to my breeder on the phone today (she is also a trainer).
When I mentioned that I 100% support positive reinforcement training, her response was "specifically with this breed, you absolutely will not get 100% of the time the desired behavior without using some type of correction. As a puppy yes, the positive reinforcement will be enough, but after that stage of thier lives, it won't be enough"
When I go visit her to meet my future pup's parents I am going to inquire more as to what she meant, what type of corrections, etc. Just curious how you other owners/trainers of the breed feel about this statement?
Agree or Disagree? and why?
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Would you agree with this statement from my breeder?
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- Just Whelped
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Retired K9 of 13 years - Lexi - German Shepherd
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- Training Dog
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Re: Would you agree with this statement from my breeder?
Everyone has their own opinion on training. All I want to say is don't let anyone convince you to do or use something you are uncomfortable with. I think sometimes positive is confused with permissive.
Positive can be done, I've done it and I am sure there are many more that have.
Positive can be done, I've done it and I am sure there are many more that have.
Patty and Ice
- centrop67
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Re: Would you agree with this statement from my breeder?
I 100% agree with ICE.
My two
During the training and life of your dog you will be incorporating corrections to some degree. It all depends on what your comfortable with. Simply turning your back on your dog because he/she is not giving you the proper behavior is a form of correction. You're probably more at ease with that than a a zap from an e-collar, yet it's still a punishment for the dog.
It's not easy, but you change trainers if their methods don't meet your needs.
A few of the old members of this group were hard core about this breed needing a firm (and harsh) correction at times - admitted to me offline mostly. I am not sure if that's just the dogs that were being protection trained, but I do know what stubborn @$$holes (Radar) the breed can be at times too.
Michael
Location - Cutler Bay, FL USA
Location - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Leela, Radar, Tequila, and Snickers If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers |
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- Just Whelped
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2022 3:42 am
- Tell us about yourself: Father of 3, work for the MA Department of Corrections.
Retired K9 of 13 years - Lexi - German Shepherd
Re: Would you agree with this statement from my breeder?
Yeah, I really think it comes down to how the dog responds to "lesser" aversive corrections such as turning the back. Some dogs may get super frustrated by this, or cause them to lose their focus, etc. So I think it is likely going to mean I need to feel out the dog and see what he responds to best to keep the training moving in a productive direction.centrop67 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 06, 2022 4:59 pmI 100% agree with ICE.
My two
During the training and life of your dog you will be incorporating corrections to some degree. It all depends on what your comfortable with. Simply turning your back on your dog because he/she is not giving you the proper behavior is a form of correction. You're probably more at ease with that than a a zap from an e-collar, yet it's still a punishment for the dog.
It's not easy, but you change trainers if their methods don't meet your needs.
A few of the old members of this group were hard core about this breed needing a firm (and harsh) correction at times - admitted to me offline mostly. I am not sure if that's just the dogs that were being protection trained, but I do know what stubborn @$$holes (Radar) the breed can be at times too.
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- Training Dog
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:32 am
- Tell us about yourself: I have a 12 week old dutch shepherd that my trainer got for me to train in schutzhund. This is my 1st dutch shepherd, I have always had german shepherds. Currently, I have 4 dogs.
Re: Would you agree with this statement from my breeder?
I am obviously not very good with the quote thing, LOL But wanted to comment on the last section about old members. It does not require a heavy hand for protection training. ICE is a IGP3 dog and got high in trial for his IGP1, IGP2 and IGP3. Just club trials but it can be done. It certainly took me longer to teach him all the behaviors required but I didn't care.centrop67 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 06, 2022 4:59 pmI 100% agree with ICE.
My two
During the training and life of your dog you will be incorporating corrections to some degree. It all depends on what your comfortable with. Simply turning your back on your dog because he/she is not giving you the proper behavior is a form of correction. You're probably more at ease with that than a a zap from an e-collar, yet it's still a punishment for the dog.
It's not easy, but you change trainers if their methods don't meet your needs.
A few of the old members of this group were hard core about this breed needing a firm (and harsh) correction at times - admitted to me offline mostly. I am not sure if that's just the dogs that were being protection trained, but I do know what stubborn @$$holes (Radar) the breed can be at times too.
I feel the most important thing is only do what you feel is right. Don't do whatever any trainer tells you because at the end of the day, you live with the dog and it is your responsibility to do right by him, whatever "right" means to you.
Patty and Ice
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Re: Would you agree with this statement from my breeder?
I've read in the past few years about the difference between negative reinforcement and simply letting a negative thing happen
Tim L.
Aurora(Shiloh) Endeavor
Aurora(Shiloh) Endeavor