Is It Possible???

[karenz]

I'm wondering if anyone has ever used a ds as a service dog. My mom just had decompression and fusion surgery. Xander has been great the last few weeks. His sit stay is unbelievable. He has learned to gently follow mom through the house and patiently wait as she changes clothes or uses the bathroom.

She had surgery yesterday and came home today. He was pretty wound up at first but is doing great with the patient sit stay, follow, wait thing again.

I have always tried to teach him "bring me ball", "ball", but I get kong. Or "kong" and I get tire, etc... But he doesn't do well with that. He will bring me something but not necessarily what I ask for. Lol.

I would love to teach him to bring her stuff. Like "shoes". But she would probably end up with a ball. Lol. And he would need to learn to sit stay and wait without being told. Like a little shadow, always there, ready, but not in your face, which he likes to be. I think I can figure out the training part.

Also, his energy is HIGH. Is it even conceivable to think a ds could learn to be a service dog, with patience, and gentleness. I'm thinking even if I taught him "bring shoes", they would be really chomped and slobber and well played with by the time she got them. Lol

[Raven]

A former member was training her DS youngin' to assist her, including eventual training how to pick up a dropped pill without swallowing it.

If Xander is a quick study, you should be able to teach some basic stuff once you figure out your mother's needs. Since she's already had the surgery, you're a little pressed but recovery from that surgery isn't overnight, either.

Don't underestimate X's ability to retrieve shoes (whatever) without chewing them. Thor brings and/or picks up sneaks, slippers, socks, etc. without fanfare. He simply does the job. Same as with helping with the laundry, handing me things I dropped or ask him to go get and bring, etc. He was a huge goofball when I adopted him; he learned there's times it's okay to be goofy and there's times to respond seriously.

[johninny]

i agree on that score, i.e., that DS are good at discerning when is the right time to play and when a more serious attitude is needed. obviously, the actual training part is another matter - depends on your patience and know-how and his proclivities, but i have no doubt that attitude/personality-wise, he can rise to the occasion if he can be taught what is wanted/needed of him.

[karenz]

Thor brings and/or picks up sneaks, slippers, socks, etc. without fanfare. He simply does the job. Same as with helping with the laundry, handing me things I dropped or ask him to go get and bring, etc. He was a huge goofball when I adopted him; he learned there's times it's okay to be goofy and there's times to respond seriously.

I think Xander will do fine with not destroying stuff. He just has so much energy. I tell him bring me ball, he runs full speed and returns with kong. I say no bring ball and he runs and brings tire, etc... and vise versa. His energy is so amped he just goes full speed and doesn't concentrate on what I'm actually telling him.

He does do very good walking with her through the house and sits and stays perfectly while she is doing something. Of course he has to be given the command. I think once he realizes what we want him to do he will do it automatically.

[karenz]

i agree on that score, i.e., that DS are good at discerning when is the right time to play and when a more serious attitude is needed. obviously, the actual training part is another matter - depends on your patience and know-how and his proclivities, but i have no doubt that attitude/personality-wise, he can rise to the occasion if he can be taught what is wanted/needed of him.

I have plenty of patience for teaching him. The know how I learn as I go.

Xander thinks all the time is play time unless I put on his pinch collar. Then he knows ok it's time to go to school. No more play. But I don't know about leaving that on him all day around the house.

[Raven]

No to leaving the prong on him, you're right.

His energy is so amped he just goes full speed and doesn't concentrate on what I'm actually telling him.

Are you working on focus? Do you have cues he picks up on?

I kept play as play and work as work until Thor matured and accepted the fact there are rules and learned them, lest the lines blurred too much for the maniac.

While he can tell from my movement/tone what the deal is, if we're playing and he gets amped, he sometimes will do what you described Xander doing above. That's when I "ground his energy," calmly put his focus on me, maybe with a sit/watch command, maybe with showing him my finger (my index finger is a powerful tool !), etc. But it does just that, grounds his energy, gives him clarity and focus.

[karenz]

That's when I "ground his energy," calmly put his focus on me, maybe with a sit/watch command, maybe with showing him my finger (my index finger is a powerful tool !), etc. But it does just that, grounds his energy, gives him clarity and focus.

Xander responds well to the finger. I can throw my finger up and he has gotten to where he will immediately sit and stare at me. (Of course sometimes he frustrates me and I give him the wrong finger, lol).

[Owned-By-Hendrix]

I would say it's totally possible as long as Xander's attitude and want to work aligns with the type of commands you'll be teaching. If you make it fun he'll love it. Just a new set of rules to learn and more self control to work on.

[karenz]

So Xander is trying very hard. He doesn't chew up anything but his object identification sucks. And he isn't in a big hurry to bring it. Lol. But it is fun for him. Mom may get shoes instead of socks 20 minutes after she asks but oh well.

[Owned-By-Hendrix]

When I was teaching H how to retrieve his ball versus his air hose pipe, I realized I had to spend a LOT of time on one object, what it was, what it smelled like. So besides visually retrieving (i.e., throwing it and him running to get it) we did nose work games with it, hide and seek with it, and practiced retrieve holds with it, everywhere and anywhere I could think of. The object was not only to get him used to bringing me the object, but also if he couldn't see it to search for it. Then we started with another object, same routine, and once I was comfortable he knew each item individually, I started asking him to identify them while they were together by using nose work games. Also, I found I accidentally taught him the names of his toys while we were playing by constantly naming it, "where's black ball? Get black ball. Bring black ball. Black ball. Find black ball." which also helped with object identification.

Xander is such a smart boy he'll get the hang of it. H sucked at object identification for a loooooooong time too. It's really more about teaching them to think about the retrieve and how to bring it to you. If his search drive (not even sure if this is the right term) is lower than his other drives, you can increase it with search games. H had to work his way up from simple, 2 second searches to 2 minute searches as he learned the value in the object he was searching for, and that searching for it always ended in good things.

[Raven]

There weren't any issues with Thor learning object identification or having a swift retrieve...but we had previously done a ton of work on focus (which had been one big problem area) without distraction (distractions being another problem area) which resulted in him holding the highest regard for rewards that became high value for him. (And he discovered how much he loved to work rather than being a complete goofball...or a jackass, as was sometimes the case.)

With Xander, have you tried doing some super-easy quickie exercises with one established object (no scent balls) where he knows the item--and where he'd have to be on another continent to fail? Once it's reliable, switch object. Increase difficulty as he gets more solid.

He's smart...I'm thinking maybe he's not quite convinced what's being asked??????

No shredding. GOOD BOY!

[karenz]

We worked today on bring me the WHITE ball. He just looks at me like I'm stupid and brings me any random object. So I put away everything except the white ball. And after I asked for the white ball 20 times I would go get the white ball and repeat white ball white ball white ball and give it to him. I'm starting to think he is training me to get his white ball for him. But we are going to keep trying.

His white ball is his favorite inside ball so I thought he would get that pretty quick. Outside however he is doing great, he started to get stubborn again on coming when called but we worked on that today and he did much better. I'm using his favorite outside ball as his reward and he is doing really good.

[Owned-By-Hendrix]

What if you have the white ball on the floor, no distractions (meaning all other toys are put up), just you, Xander, and the ball. Mark and reward him for when he looks at the WHITE ball, then progress up to touching it, holding it, then gently lobbing it 6 inches, 1 foot, 2 foot away? H had me trained to help him search for his black ball until I caught onto that act. He knew what it was, to go grab it as part of a game, but find it? Hah mom needed to be present for that game. So I went back to basics and would say "black ball" and he had to nose it before I threw it. I kept labeling while we played too - took about 2 weeks. I would roll it when he wasn't looking (quietly... jeez that was hard) and ask "where is" (he knew where is is his cue to search) and "black ball". You could see the lights go on in his brain - HEY I KNOW THOSE WORDS. We practiced it so much until I would be talking to the barista trying to order coffee but end up asking if they'd seen black ball....

Sounds crazy but I think of it like this, when I learn a new language I have to be reminded every two seconds what an object is called. The more I practice and use the word, think about it, try to find it in other contexts, the easier it is for me to remember it later. I try to apply the same concept when I'm labeling things for H, which makes me sound crazy but he's learned the pattern and picks up pretty fast now.

[Raven]

Confused...are you using two different balls to teach and calling them both balls but saying their color first? (White ball, red ball, etc.). If so, using ball after each may dilute understanding and cause confusion.

Also, how many words are you using when training this?

Thor knows I-don't-know-how-many objects by name, but each one has a distinct and separate ring. Of his balls, Evil Baby is his orange ball, Punkish is a multicolored creepy-looking ball, etc. Greeny is one of many treat dispensers as are Bedtime Bone, Dinner Kong, Chewy, etc.

Dogs will sometimes hear the beginning of sound of a word (or other part of) and "not hear" the rest. I thought Thor might confuse shoes, socks, slippers, and sneaks...which he didn't...but perhaps only because he was far enough along when we worked with those items where he felt comfortable with such nuances. (Make sense?)

Also, if you're not already, keep mindful of how many extraneous words you're throwing out when teaching something new or something they're struggling with. We talk in sentences. Dogs not so much. Piggy-backing on Kira's language example, if they're hearing a bunch of gibberish (extraneous words they don't understand), they have no context for the one or two words you do say that they do understand.

[karenz]

I just say "white ball", "get white ball". I don't have any other objects out. After I say "white ball" if he doesn't get it I walk him to it pick it up and repeat "white ball" several times and give it to him. Then I lead him to a chair, I sit down, hold my hand out and say "white ball, give white ball", and he will give it to me.

[karenz]

I think we are making progress. Yesterday I told Xander "tire" and voila, I got a tire. He did this twice in a row. Then I said "kong" and voila, I get the kong. Still no luck with specifically red kong and black kong.

I think with some work I can teach him shoes and slippers. But getting him to put them in his mouth might be hard since as a puppy he was told to leave those things alone. We shall see.

[Raven]

When you say 'red' Kong, 'black' Kong...you don't literally mean you're asking him to differentiate two colors of objects that are the same shape, correct?

Hey...if I was able to teach my adopted gremlin to leave everything alone and then teach him to bring or "bin" sneaks, socks, shoes, slippers, etc. in a civil, orderly and timely fashion, you certainly can with Xander.

[karenz]

When you say 'red' Kong, 'black' Kong...you don't literally mean you're asking him to differentiate two colors of objects that are the same shape, correct?

Hey...if I was able to teach my adopted gremlin to leave everything alone and then teach him to bring or "bin" sneaks, socks, shoes, slippers, etc. in a civil, orderly and timely fashion, you certainly can with Xander.

One kong is bigger than the other. I "named" them red kong, black kong. I'm not sure if he will ever tell them apart. The theory was to teach him to differentiate between very similar shoes.

I have never taught Xander to "bin" his toys but sometimes he picks them up and puts them in a waste basket in our den. Then he barks at the basket like he thinks the basket stole his toys. I thought about buying him one of those 2 feet tall toddler basketball goals from Walmart and teaching him to shoot some hoops. I'm always looking for more inside activities for bad weather days.

[Raven]

He'll get it...you've just put him in the accelerated summer program before he took freshman classes.

Thor knows the difference between my husband's and my slippers, my sneaks and my slippers, his PB bone and his new PB bone (identical in shape but one's a bit longer), etc., etc. But this is old-hat learning for him, whereas X is under a little pressure...as are, I suspect, you, since you hadn't planned this.

Right after my post to you about keeping names of things distinct when beginning, didn't my husband bring home a new treat dispenser (another one!) and called it 'jimmy.' I'd just given him a new dispenser that I called 'chimney.' I crabbed at the husband unnecessarily. Thor's never confused them.

It won't be long before you'll be posting all the amazing things X has done to help your mom.